Whenever Kris and I chat, there's an agenda, which is totally useless. Every single time we've talked, the conversation goes into different (I'll argue better) directions. In this episode, Kris and I delve into the art and craft of programming, finding your tribe as a developer advocate, and so much more. I hope you enjoy this great and meandering conversation.

Developer Voices podcast: https://open.spotify.com/show/2gXhwz0AQRv2cvw61kobE5

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Kris's Twitter: https://twitter.com/krisajenkins

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